Anita Arnand

Final question, because we are running out of time.

Who is the person you really want to get who's proving hard to get?

Because we might be able to help you.

90 million downloads, I know it's nothing to you, but they might be listening.

Who do you want to get?

That's going to be lovely.

No one's going to push anyone.

No one's going to shove anybody in that one.

Hopefully not.

It's going to be quite a letdown to people who expect a certain benefit of brutality.

Listen, it's been so great talking to you.

I know we have to let you go because you've got a school run.

And that, as we all know, is the most important thing.

Thank you so much for being with us.

Louis' documentary, The Settlers, is on BBC iPlayer.

Inside the Manosphere, you can find that on Netflix.

And until the next time we meet, it's goodbye from me, Anita Arnon.

This is the early 1600s, and these men have created a company that in today's money is so wealthy that at its peak, it's more than twice the value of Apple and Nvidia combined.

And I'm Anita Arnand, and we are the hosts of a fellow Goldhanger History podcast called Empire.

It's a story of the very first corporate espionage, the colonisation of Indonesia and a swap that leads to the creation of New York City.