Anita Arnand

And how did the rivalry between the British and the Dutch end with the British East India Company with the most lucrative colony on earth and the Dutch East India Company completely bankrupt?

And we've included a clip from the miniseries at the end of this episode for you to enjoy.

Hello, it's Anita again from Empire.

And here's a clip from our miniseries on the extraordinary story of the Dutch East India Company in the 1600s.

And it revolves around this tiny dried seed that you might have seen in your kitchens.

I mean, if you've ever made a bechamel sauce or mulled wine or pumpkin pie or in India, very much use masala chai.

I mean, a staple of everyday nutmeg is your go-to spice.

Masala chai has got nutmeg.

If it's a good masala chai, it will have cloves, nutmeg and cinnamon.

You know, it was attributed or it was credited with so many magical powers, Giles.

I mean, I was looking up cure for flatulence, cure for dysentery, a hallucinogen, blood poisoning.

I mean, was there anything they thought it didn't do?

And they had celebrity believers as well.

I mean, Peeps is one of those people who swore by the stuff.

He said, you know, this is the only thing that saved me while others have died around me.

Hello and welcome to Empire with me, Anita Arnand.

So episode four of our Simon Bolivar miniseries now.

And in our last episode, we saw Bolivar seeing off his liberal vice president and being pronounced Presidente Liberator.

You know, you were asking about what was going through his mind at the time.

You know, what was he thinking?