Bella Freud

That's great to be young and excited instead of young and paranoid.

Because I think of that.

There's a certain thing in one's 20s, I find, that...

It's like life finishes at 30.

So if you haven't done it in your 20s, it's like life's over.

And then I found when I got to 30, I thought, oh my God, I'm actually young.

I should just enjoy some of this instead of being driven by the humanities at my heels, you know, just like in this sense of, but maybe because I wasn't really achieving stuff in my 20s, but it's a wonderful thing.

Yeah, it's incredible.

Yeah.

Because you've cited Zadie Smith as a big heroine and

I wondered what do you find so compelling about the way she uses language?

Yeah, she is amazing.

Has she been on this?

She has.

Oh, okay.

My first recording was with her and then Rick Owens.

Wow.

And I had a picture of...

certain people who I thought would really illuminate this idea that had been kind of, I'd wanted to try and make work for a few years.

And so I had the good fortune to, she was the first person and Rick came in the evening.