Dr. Christof (Christoph) Koch

Right.

No textbook, except at the very end, they say, well, yeah, people claim they have consciousness, but they don't know how to fit that in with receptors and with atoms and with nuclear energy because it doesn't seem to fit into there.

Except we find ourselves in a universe where we are conscious.

Sorry, I... Please don't apologize.

Well, I mean, look, if someone hits me on the head, you cancel consciousness, right?

We talked about it before.

If you choke me, you know, within eight seconds, I lose consciousness.

So it's fragile.

But the point about many of these experiences, they're very, very different, very extraordinary, you know, states of consciousness, but which shows you that self isn't required in even space and time that we think is so essential may not be required.

Or is not required.

No sentient creature can come outside of their perception box because you're always, your reality is always constructed by something.

Right.

And computers won't be any different if they ever become sentient.

In principle, yeah.

But of course, today's AI, they reinforce them, right?

You know, if you read all these horror stories about people who fall in love with AI or those people that kill themselves because the AI didn't reinforce their worst tendency.

Yeah.

If you have a sufficient, clever AI that...

A, accesses your mental state, which right now the only way you could do it by you talking to it, right?

That's the only way.