John Kiriakou

We just decided we didn't like his politics.

And so we blew him up.

And then a week later, we blew up his 16-year-old son and 16-year-old nephew, also American citizens.

They had never been accused of a crime.

So either we're going to be a nation of laws.

or we're not going to be a nation of laws.

We have to choose, but we can't pretend to be the one while really being the other.

We need to make a policy decision here.

But may I answer further to answer more specifically your question?

Way back in the bad old days, in the early 1970s, a dear friend of mine started as a 22-year-old at the agency, and his initial job was in the Counterintelligence Center, which was then headed by the notorious James Jesus Angleton.

And on his first day, the secretary was walking him around the office and she pointed to an entire wall of file folders.

And she said, you may find yourself alone in the office every once in a while.

You are not permitted to look at those files.

Well, of course, what's he going to do?

He's 22 years old.

As soon as he's alone, he's going to run and look at the files.

And he said, and now he's in his 70s.

He said every single one of those files was on an American citizen.

Now that was patently illegal.

but they were doing it anyway.