Josh van Cuylenburg

And he's recently taken a new job that is 100% work from home, basically.

And my initial thought was that's going to be really hard for him because he's such an extrovert.

But the more I thought about it is how sad for a workplace to not have that personality around in the room bringing that joy to people

to so much of that, of these people's days.

I mean, we spend so much time at work more than we do at, than a lot of us spend in our intimate relationships.

And I'm really, and I started really spiraling or thinking more about how sad, I get that work from home is very convenient for a lot of people, but what does that do to our mental health, our wellbeing when we don't have this real fulfilling in-person relationship every day at a workplace?

Wow.

Yeah, it's a beautiful metaphor for the whole thing.

I realise I've also, I didn't realise it till then, but I feel like I've lived an example of what happens to a relationship as well, or at least the difference, because this friend lives in New York and I don't get to see him much and he was out here over summer and he came round to my house and had dinner with my family and I just, the memories of every little bit of his movement, of playing with the kids, of everything he did that day,

Just in what it did for our relationship compared to phone calls or Zooms over the previous two years, it was like it just didn't stack up compared to one evening spent together in person.

Yeah.

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No wonder you get nervous.

Yeah, it also feels like the facts always, they never go in the direction of things aren't quite as bad as you think.

Like they always, they never go in the place of, as you just said, things are a bit more nuanced and it's not quite as extreme.