Lisa Harper

And instead of it leading to ongoing despair—

it's like it opened their eyes bigger to the compassion of God of, oh, even though I bring nothing to the table, you still put me at your right hand and I'm a co-heir with Christ.

It's like the gospel gets bigger.

And I think, I mean, that certainly has happened for me.

And the word, aren't y'all shocked by how many people

who are on an elliptical or driving their car or in a coffee shop or making dinner will have y'all in their earbuds buds and they want authentic conversation about God.

One of my other favorite dead guys,

Francis Schaeffer says, biblical orthodoxy without compassion is surely the ugliest thing in the world.

So I think what y'all do so well, it's the relational stuff that you're so great at with the biblical, and you have great biblical insight next to Jesus.

But if we just do that linear and preach at people and they don't feel heard, it's a miss.

Right.

Oh, I cried when I saw it.

Were you able to, like, get it together and, like, land the plane again?

Well, and it took me a long time to figure out.

People really don't want to see where you got it right.

They want to see basically where you landed in a pit and God pulled you out.

And he's to be the hero of every story.

And I think even if he gives you platform, the best communicators, I mean, we just don't ever rob God of the glory.

You tell stories, but they have to point to who Jesus is.

And, yeah, I still have train wrecks.