Terry Gross

speaker

23,578 appearances 400 recordings 17 series first heard Nov 2024 last heard yesterday

Terry Gross’s voice in public audio — every appearance, attributed to the second.

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recordings per month · last 12 months

Recordings per month over the last 12 months — 276 in all, peaking in Jul 2026 with 77.

Appearances

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Fresh Air · The Roy Cohn Playbook, from McCarthyism to Trump · 17 Sep 2026 podcast

Cohn was indicted by the Justice Department on three occasions of bribery, perjury, and extortion and other white collar crimes, and was always acquitted. voice-verified

But in nineteen eighty six, after being accused of bribery and fraud, he was disbarred. voice-verified

This was just a few weeks before he died of AIDS, which he always denied having, claiming it was liver cancer. voice-verified

Byrd says Cohn's story is important because of what it teaches us about the fragile character of American democracy. voice-verified

Kai Bird, welcome to Fresh Air and congratulations on the biography. voice-verified

Um you you say that Roy Cohn's rules became Trump rules. voice-verified

Now there were a couple of Cohn rules that became Trump rules that I was familiar with, like never admit you were wrong, deny, deny, deny. voice-verified

And then when there are charges against you, delay, delay, delay. voice-verified

Can you think of an example where all three were used by Rory Cohn? voice-verified

So did all of that help him get off on those charges? voice-verified

Okay, uh other rules like sue, counter sue, or threaten to and basically send the message that whether you win or lose voice-verified

It's gonna be a headache if you don't give in. voice-verified

So um voice-verified

Uh voice-verified

So what lessons do you think um President Trump learned from Royal Cohn about uh paying bills and paying taxes? voice-verified

Another Roy Cohn rule, don't tell me the law, tell me the judge. voice-verified

Because he knew how to voice-verified

Like which judge would be um favorable to him or which judge he could manipulate, I assume that's what he meant. voice-verified

Well Trump kind of did him one better on don't tell me the law, tell me the judge because voice-verified

As president, he's appointed judges, he's appointed Supreme Court justices, and some of those people I mean they've ruled on things that Trump has done. voice-verified

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