TPP 347: Raising a Demand Avoidant Child or Teen (PDA), with Casey Ehrlich
episode
Full-Tilt Parenting: Strategies, Insights, and Connection for Parents Raising Neurodivergent Children
44 min
1 speaker
4 chapters
transcribed 14 hours ago
Transcript
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Transcript generated automatically by AI and may contain errors.
What is Pathological Demand Avoidance (PDA) and how does it differ from other autism profiles?
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Demand avoidance can be caused by lots of things, right? Like I don't want to get my shoes on because they hurt my feet. Sensory. I don't want to get my shoes on because I don't know which step in the routine it is. Maybe that's executive functioning. I didn't understand I needed to get my shoes on. Social communication difference. I don't want to get my shoes on because you told me to. Survival drive for autonomy, right? So, it's like we can see the surface level indicators, but understanding that root cause is so important to support kids in the way that they need to be supported.
I'm Debbie Reber and welcome to Tilt Parenting, a podcast featuring interviews and conversations aimed at inspiring, informing and supporting parents raising differently wired kids. I'm really happy to be bringing another conversation about PDA to the show, especially as awareness and understanding of this complex profile of autism is growing and more and more parents are looking for resources to navigate this especially challenging parenting journey. Oh, and in case you're not familiar with PDA, it's an acronym that technically stands for Pathological Demand Avoidance, though many people who identify as PDAers prefer the words Persistent Desire for Autonomy. My guest for today's conversation is Casey Ehrlich, a social scientist who only four years ago was leading a team of researchers at a large nonprofit in Washington, D.C.
until her world fell apart. In response to her autistic son's increasingly challenging meltdowns, and after he stopped eating, walking, and speaking, Casey pivoted her life and spent a year as a full-time caregiver, mother, and researcher of her child. When she came across pathological demand avoidance, suddenly everything made sense. Today, Casey is a coach and educator to parents raising PDA children and teens, the founder of At Peace Parents, and the co-host of a podcast by the same name. She brings her background in social science, methodology, and research to take an objective and non-judgmental approach to supporting families. And as you'll hear from our chat, she is an incredibly validating, supportive presence who any parent raising a PDA child would benefit from.
In our conversation, Casey sheds light on how to approach raising a child with PDA at different stages, explores the differences between PDA and ODD, considers how burnout manifests in someone with PDA, and explains how a child with a PDA profile might experience a loss of autonomy and equality on a daily basis. Casey also walks us through her framework for supporting families with PDA kids and what it takes to find peace and acceptance in showing up for a PDA child no matter what. I hope you enjoy our conversation. So let's get right to it. Here's Casey Ehrlich on Parenting a Child with PDA. Hey, Casey, welcome to the podcast. Hi, Debbie. Thanks for having me. Yeah, my pleasure. I was mentioning this before I hit record, but your name has been coming up in my community for quite a while, specifically surrounding your work on PDA.
And so I had to do kind of a deep dive into you and what you're doing right now. But my listeners haven't done that. Could you tell us a little bit about what you're doing right now, kind of
your work in the world?
Yeah.
Sure. So right now I run a business called At Peace Parents, which focuses specifically on supporting parents to raise and focusing on supports for the nervous system and providing autonomy and equality. And I'm happy to talk specifically about how to do this in order to bring cumulative nervous system activation down, for example, if they're in burnout. And help them create new neural pathways to stay in the thinking brain more so they can access learning and growth.
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Chapters
4 chapters
1
What is Pathological Demand Avoidance (PDA) and how does it differ from other autism profiles?
0:00–6:49
2
How did Casey Ehrlich’s personal caregiving journey lead her to focus on PDA?
6:49–12:06
3
What are the key differences between PDA and Oppositional Defiant Disorder (ODD)?
12:06–24:16
4
How does nervous‑system burnout manifest in children with a PDA profile?
24:16–44:35
Speakers
1 identifiedMore from Full-Tilt Parenting: Strategies, Insights, and Connection for Parents Raising Neurodivergent Children
TPP 266a: A Conversation with Poet and Advocate LeDerick Horne
TPP 522: A Whole Child Approach to ADHD with Phil Boucher, M.D.
TPP 091a: A Conversation With Steve Silberman About His Book “Neurotribes”
TPP 521: A Conversation with Dr. Peter Gray About Restoring Childhood
TPP 253a: Advocate and Author Jonathan Mooney on Why Normal Sucks
TPP 520: Dr. Özgür Bolat on Why Rewards Backfire and the Real Science of Motivating Kids