Kevin Russell (Does AI Think Before Speaking?)
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What personal stories does the host share before diving into AI?
Radio Mano, Papachango.
What's up, General Public? How's it going out there in the world in your part of the world? Uh, speaking of uh of my part of the world, it's windy and dry and um It's nervous, it's nervous weather. Uh both because the constant wind I think makes one nervous because it just feels like Things could fall, things could crash, things you forgot you left outside could blow away. Um Yeah, wind. What is wind? Wind is like change. It's like this raw Anyway, wind makes people crazy. I remember Kisilda. And I years ago were looking at places in Spain where we might wanna move, we were kinda tired of Barcelona and and we went down to um in the south near um the Tarifa, I think it's called, which is a great uh b a big windsurfing area, I have since learned.
Um, but it was just constant wind coming off the Atlantic. And um it was a beautiful area. We really liked it and and then later it turned out um uh a good friend of ours, Deborah, uh bought property down there and um Yeah, but anyway, we decided against it because Cassilda said, No, no, the wind, it makes too it makes people crazy and I can't stand it and you know, she's a psychiatrist, so she knows what she's talking about. But um yeah, the wind. But then here the other problem is uh it's so dry and there are fires going all over the place and so everybody's worried like Man, one cigarette butt, you know, one chain dragging behind a truck that sparks off the road. Just one fucking bit of bad luck and there's no stopping it because the wind is so strong and everything's so dry.
So nervous I'm feeling nervous. How are you feeling? I should also admit The other reason I'm feeling nervous is that I'm fasting today. I've started this uh routine of um skipping food one day a week, so I get a thirty six to forty eight hour fast once a week. Um, which is uh is good. I like the effects. I feel lighter and tighter and uh you know, sort of slimming down a little bit, which I could definitely use at this time in my life. Um, but it does i i it is kind of annoying.
Uh I feel on edge a little bit, you know. Just wanna Just wanna pig out on something, but I can't do it, so I'm like, Row I want just a handful of cashews would be so good right now.
Um anyway. Enough about me. What about you? What's going on in your world? Um This episode is a continuation of a recent theme on this podcast, which is AI. I recorded this a couple of days after I recorded the last episode with um Robert Wright. And this is a very different perspective on AI. So first episode um was with Gustave Domov, who wrote a book, uh sort of a very practical guide to um what you need to do to prepare for AI, which I highly recommend. And then we had Robert Wright, who wrote the book The God Test, um, which is, you know, he's out there talking about it everywhere at this point. I I saw him on uh Andrew Sullivan's podcast. I haven't listened to it yet, but I downloaded it. And um so, you know, m sort of a more mainstream kind of
philosophical look at what AI is in terms of the trajectory of humankind, I guess. And then I had this conversation with my friend Kevin Russell. He's been on the podcast a few times in the past. And this is a much more sort of in the trenches look at the issue from someone who is doing it, who's using it, who's developing it, who works with it every day. Um and kind of speaks the language. Uh you know, as much as I um value Robert writes thinking on these things, um, he is looking at it from a distance. He's looking at it as someone who, you know, spends his time thinking about evolution and religion and philosophy. And it's a it's a very broad kind of conversation that we had about it, which I enjoyed a lot.
This conversation with Kevin is much more granular. It's much more how does this thing work and and w what's what is cognition? Is is it is there cognition, is there language, is how is it because Kevin Kevin's a very, very smart guy. Um But he's a v he's a very free thinker in a way because he you know, as he says at the end of the episode, like I didn't even fucking finish high school.
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Chapters
8 chapters
1
What personal stories does the host share before diving into AI?
0:00–15:16
2
How does Kevin Russell describe the current state of AI research and its practical impact?
15:16–28:53
3
What is the “geometry of meaning” and why does it matter for AI alignment?
28:53–42:20
4
How does the honesty‑filter concept work and what problems does it aim to solve?
42:20–57:14
5
What ethical and political challenges arise from deploying AI at scale?
57:14–1:11:46
6
Does AI have a mind or consciousness, and how do we know?
1:11:46–1:25:11
7
What tools and open‑source projects are emerging to make AI safer?
1:25:11–1:38:44
8
How does the conversation wrap up with music, culture, and final takeaways?
1:38:44–1:52:31