Cas Holman

And they told us we needed to be good at them.

So our self-value got attached to success.

So, of course, as adults, we're going to be still obsessed with being really productive, which probably means like efficient.

You don't waste time.

No dilly-dallying.

Mm-hmm.

What are we prioritizing?

Like to what end?

And even like as a problem solving, I'm like, but is that a problem?

These problems we're solving.

First of all, today's solution is tomorrow's problem.

Plastic, cars, everything that we thought was going to be.

We're solving problems that maybe aren't problems.

And we don't know.

I try to keep an awareness of what we don't know, but we then have these systems that we're a little bit stuck with.

So being playful and approaching things as play will make us more able to kind of shift and be agile when they aren't what we expect or when they don't work out the way that we want.

Or it has to be this outcome or it's failures.

It's like, we have a show we have to put out at a certain time.

There's no time.

And actually, I think those are the people who often need play the most because play is not the antithesis.