Cas Holman

It can be a mindset.

So you can be doing your job playfully and A, lead to different outcomes if that's desired, right?

Innovation comes from play.

Yeah.

So Caltech's Jet Propulsion Laboratory, they at some point were realizing that their engineers that they were hiring were not great problem solvers.

And they interviewed them and kind of realized that a lot of them had not been tinkerers.

They hadn't played with stuff.

Model airplanes or even just like take apart the lawnmower.

And then try to put it back together or maybe not, or turn it into something else.

So they weren't tinkers.

They hadn't used their hands specifically.

So they started in their interview process, starting to filter out based on, did you tinker?

But really what that meant was, are you a playful person?

Not only did you play as a child, but do you play now?

And it's made a huge difference in the success of how innovative they are, how good they are at problem solving.

So there are ways that if somebody is really like, there's no room for this-

They make spreadsheets or an accountant.

I kind of think spreadsheets can be playful.

I had a friend who I worked with for a long time and she would make really sexy spreadsheets.

So we started calling them sex cell spreadsheets because they were like so beautiful.