Professor Tim Spector

Have things been getting better since that first version?

That's fascinating, because I can see an argument about when you're on low incomes, it's a challenge to look after your family.

That's funny.

I mean, we've never taken our daughter to a McDonald's, but that somehow hasn't changed the fact that the idea of going to McDonald's is really exciting for her, right?

So she's picked that up still through the marketing around her.

And do we see the same thing also in the UK and elsewhere in terms of the taxes?

Because I think there's definitely been the same situation across the globe around talking about taxes on highly processed foods.

And for you both, I think what I'm hearing is like the sort of food products that have been made by these big food companies just shouldn't really be treated like food in a way they should be treated like some product that's been created by anybody else.

And so if they are a leisure drug, okay.

And this comes back to what you were talking about before about like just how strong the links is between this sort of ultra-processed food and mental health.

If you have a friend or family member who you think might be interested in improving their health, share this episode with them now.

These insights could change their path, and I'm sure they'll be grateful.

It's all incredibly powerful.

I'd love to talk about what a listener could do for themselves, because you always talked a lot about society-wide forces.

What about someone's listening and saying, well, wow, you know what?

I eat a bunch of this, because who doesn't?

So I'd love to talk about your overarching principles for eating healthily.

key things you would add on top of what Mark describes?

There's definitely something about when you're a child, I don't know if it's something to do with safety or something, that it's like they quite easily want to give up these things.

There's something about the bread and the pasta and things.