BS Disclaimers, Invisible Armies, and the Importance of the Words We Choose

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The Curiosity Shop with Brené Brown and Adam Grant 1h 6m 4 speakers 8 chapters transcribed 4 months ago
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What is the main topic discussed in this episode?

Brené Brown 0:00
Welcome to The Curiosity Shop.

What is the 'Invisible Army' and how does it affect communication?

Adam Grant 0:01
A show from the Fox Media Podcast Network.
Brené Brown 0:10
Hi, everyone. I'm Brene Brown.
Adam Grant 0:12
And I'm Adam Grant.
Brené Brown 0:13
And today we're here to watch Adam be really generous to me. I don't want to be wrong on this topic today. I do not, I cannot be wrong on this topic today. I am very vested in my rightness.
Adam Grant 0:29
Wow. Okay. So you're already appealing to my core values and asking me to violate other values.
Brené Brown 0:36
You sort that shit out on your own, but I need to be right. You sort your value hierarchy over there. You do that over there. But we're going to talk about two insidious Machiavellian communication tools that people use that are my least favorite in the whole world.
Adam Grant 0:59
I can't wait, but I should say a wise friend once told me it's more important to get it right than to be right.
Brené Brown 1:07
Yeah, I call bullshit, but okay. So I think we all know this first one. It is, I'm guilty of doing it and I've been on the receiving end of it. And it's hard.

How do 'BS Disclaimers' undermine accountability?

Brené Brown 1:20
I call it in my work, the invisible army. So in a work context, you're my boss and I come up to you and I say, hey, Adam, we're really exhausted. All of us are really tired of the way these priorities are shifting. We're really kind of sick of the pressure on us to do more with less and we need a break. What's your first instinct there?
Adam Grant 1:48
I want to hear more.
Brené Brown 1:49
Okay. Let me tell you my first instinct. Let's turn the scenario around. You come to me and say, we're all exhausted. We're tired. We're the constant reprioritization is killing us. We need a break. I'm going to want to look at you and say, you got a mouse in your pocket? Like, who's we? I cannot. This invisible army, we all think, we all believe, we're all wondering, right? Like, come to me with the eye. That's important enough.

What is the difference between responsibility and accountability?

Brené Brown 2:23
But for me, the invisible army of the people that are backing up your, you know, and even in the personal world, listen, we're all really disappointed by this. Or, you know, we all think you should talk to dad about this.
Adam Grant 2:40
This is so fascinating. This is exactly the kind of communication I teach.
Brené Brown 2:44
You teach people to say we?
Adam Grant 2:47
Absolutely.

How does judgment based on gender and identity impact communication?

Adam Grant 2:48
It's I mean, it signals that you're not selfish, that you're thinking about the good of the group. And, you know, you're you're not raising something that's idiosyncratic. It's actually relevant to everyone.
Brené Brown 2:59
It's chicken shit. I completely disagree. Unless you're willing to say to me, hey, Adam, do you have a second? I sat down and spoke with Sabrina, Jose, and Jack around what's going on. And we kind of came up with some ideas. They were not able to meet with you, but they said that I could talk to you about this.

What strategies can enhance psychological safety in conversations?

Brené Brown 3:23
I mean... I think it's terrible. Like, I literally, like, unless you have a critter in your pocket, I don't ever want to hear your invisible army.
Adam Grant 3:36
Okay, I do. I want to hear it all the time, but I don't want it to be invisible.

How can precision of language improve workplace dynamics?

Adam Grant 3:40
So I think what you just outlined is ideal in an environment with high psychological safety.

What are the main takeaways from today’s episode?

Adam Grant 3:45
That's the standard I'm aspiring to all the time. And anyone should be able to speak on behalf of the group, or ideally everyone is speaking independently for themselves. In environments that lack psychological safety, if you're in a culture of fear, if you're in a culture of blame and shame, it's really risky to put yourself out there. And so if I'm the one to come to you and say, hey, I've heard a lot of people complaining about this. Everyone else is afraid to tell you that for me, that's an act of courage, right? Because I'm the messenger and I might get shot. And it's so important that I'm willing to raise it anyway on behalf of the group.
Brené Brown 4:19
You did not say we once in your role model here. Oh, I'm not role modeling it.
Adam Grant 4:23
I'm explaining.
Brené Brown 4:24
I'm just saying, you said, I'm coming to you because here's what I'm hearing. And I think other people are concerned about it. So I wanted to let you know. That is not the invisible army.
Adam Grant 4:34
Isn't it though? No. Aren't they less visible?
Brené Brown 4:37
No, no, no. That is, no. I think that's very different than you arming yourself with, we all believe, we all think. You're saying, I'm observing this. I wanted to let you know about my observation.

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